Keith Fiscus | From Combat Medic to Growing and Scaling a New Business in a New Industry
Smart Business Revolution

Keith Fiscus is the Founder and CEO of Innovative Career Resources and Staffing, a professional recruiting and staffing firm specializing in accounting, finance, biotechnology, pharmaceutical, nutraceutical, customer experience, and executive administrative professionals. He is based in Orange County, California. 

Keith is also a proud veteran of the United States Army (Airborne). After completing his enlistment in the Army, he parlayed his experience as a combat medic into a career in the healthcare industry as an emergency room nurse. His experience in healthcare and passion for science inspired him to transition into the field of talent acquisition. He is also active in Entrepreneurs’ Organization (EO) and served as President of the Orange County Chapter of EO.

In this episode of the Smart Business Revolution Podcast, John Corcoran interviews Keith Fiscus, the Founder and CEO of Innovative Career Resources and Staffing, about his experience working as a combat medic in Thailand and his transition into entrepreneurship. Keith also talks about joining Entrepreneurs’ Organization (EO), how his mother supported his business, and how he struggled before finding even greater success. Stay tuned.

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Here’s a Glimpse of What You’ll Hear:

  • What Keith Fiscus learned from working as a combat medic in Thailand
  • How Keith struggled with substance abuse and self-doubt 
  • Keith discusses his military background and transition to entrepreneurship
  • How Keith’s mother invested and helped him build his company
  • Keith talks about finding a niche for his business, getting Scott Empringham to join his EO board, and his desire to help others
  • The peers Keith respects and how to get in touch with him

Resources Mentioned In This Episode

Sponsor: Rise25

At Rise25, we’re committed to helping you connect with your Dream 100 referral partners, clients, and strategic partners through our done-for-you podcast solution. 

We’re a professional podcast production agency that makes creating a podcast effortless. Since 2009, our proven system has helped thousands of B2B businesses build strong relationships with referral partners, clients, and audiences without doing the hard work.

What do you need to start a podcast?

When you use our proven system, all you need is an idea and a voice. We handle the strategy, production, and distribution – you just need to show up and talk.

The Rise25 podcasting solution is designed to help you build a profitable podcast. This requires a specific strategy, and we’ve got that down pat. We focus on making sure you have a direct path to ROI, which is the most important component. Plus, our podcast production company takes any heavy lifting of production and distribution off your plate.

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We’ll distribute each episode across more than 11 unique channels, including iTunes, Spotify, and Google Podcasts. We’ll also create copy for each episode and promote your show across social media.

Cofounders Dr. Jeremy Weisz and John Corcoran credit podcasting as being the best thing they have ever done for their businesses. Podcasting connected them with the founders/CEOs of P90xAtariEinstein BagelsMattelRx BarsYPO, EO, Lending Tree, Freshdesk,  and many more.  

The relationships you form through podcasting run deep. Jeremy and John became business partners through podcasting. They have even gone on family vacations and attended weddings of guests who have been on the podcast.

Podcast production has a lot of moving parts and is a big commitment on our end; we only want to work with people who are committed to their business and to cultivating amazing relationships.

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Contact us now at [email protected] or book a call at

Rise25 Cofounders, Dr. Jeremy Weisz and John Corcoran, have been podcasting and advising about podcasting since 2008.

Episode Transcript

Intro 0:01

Welcome to the revolution, the Smart Business Revolution Podcast where we ask today’s most successful entrepreneurs to share the tools and strategies they use to build relationships and connections to grow their revenue. Now, your host for the revolution, John Corcoran.

John Corcoran 0:40

Welcome everyone, I’m the host of the show. This is John Corcoran. And every week I talk to interesting CEOs, founders and entrepreneurs of all kinds of different companies. We’ve talked to CEOs. We’ve talked to, you know, founders of Kinkos’ and Netflix and Activision Blizzard and LendingTree and Open Table, go check out some of the archives of some great episodes back there. I’m also the Co-founder of Rise25, where we help connect b2b business owners to their ideal prospects. And a quick shout out to Scott Empringham of Empringham Media Group, go look him up. He does great work if you want social media support for your business. And he’s just a great genuine individual, but he told me about today’s guest. And so I’m really excited to talk to him. His name is Keith Fiscus. He’s the Founder and CEO of Innovative Career Resources and Staffing. It’s a professional recruiting and staffing firm specializing in a variety of different industries. He’s based in the general Orange County, California area. He’s also a proud veteran, the United States Army, in the Airborne. After he completed his enlistment in the army, he parlayed his experience as a combat medic into a career in the healthcare industry as an emergency room nurse. And now he’s had his company for about 20 years. He has also been really active in Entrepreneurs’ Organization, including serving as president of the Orange County Chapter of Entrepreneurs’ Organization. 

And of course, this episode is brought to you by Rise25 Media where we help b2b businesses to get clients, referrals, and strategic partnerships with done for you podcasts and content marketing. If you want to learn more about that, you can shoot us an email at [email protected] or go to Alright, Keith, it’s a pleasure to have you here today. And I want to start with a story from when you were in the 82nd airborne. You were working in civil affairs, and you were deployed to Thailand, which we weren’t as a country, the United States was not officially in that country at the time. But you kind of had a crazy experience with your combat medic, and Thailand and Myanmar. I’d been at war for many years, and you show up in a village hoping this village to rebuild. They got an orphanage there. I’m sure there are a lot of lessons that you apply to your career as an entrepreneur. But tell us a story. Tell us what it was like living through that experience.

Keith Fiscus 3:00

See me first and foremost, John, thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it looking forward to this. Yeah, I mean, again, you mentioned I was in the military. I was in the Army. I was a medic. And one of the locations that the unit I was in. We were responsible for Thailand, we responsible for Vanuatu in New Guinea we are responsible for gosh, what snore loud, that’s north of Vietnam. It’s is driving me crazy. But anyways, I was in I was stationed in Thailand, we did a quick three, three week operation there it was myself and seven other guys. And then we also had one advisor for a bi advisor with us. So amazing experience. You know, we were in this little village in northern Northwest Thailand, and I believe it was village by the name of talk T AK. And as a civil affairs unit, we are basically hearts and minds. So basically the government sends civil affairs where they need to whether it’s helping infrastructure. Constitution, we did that in Haiti when several years ago Gosh, back in the late 90s when they had their revolution or you know, a people out there so yeah, we were on an engineering operation basically there to help them we are in an orphanage help them build basically more another dormitory more space. There was this huge influx of Burmese or Miramar. Now, citizens who were coming into Vietnam because they’d been at border scrimmages for years have been at war. And they were just kind of, you know, just overflow so they needed more space to house a lot of these orphanages. So we’re there for about three weeks. Just incredible experience, you know, they’d never seen a From my understanding, and based on he arrived, they never seen, you know, Americans, American soldiers, they, so we would say, Hey, if you see people like us in the same green color, it’s okay, everything’s good. So, but working with the kids was incredible, you know, they had a school there along with the orphanage, so you know, people were taking there, they would drop off their kids there and see him once a month, they would just let him stay there. So they could, they can get education things that we take. So that was really impactful. You know, and I might have mentioned it before, but you know, that’s one of the things that kind of, you know, that troubles me sometimes when, you know, people so easily kind of, say, bash us. But, you know, again, like I said, you know, we’re not perfect, but pretty much everyone’s got a pair of shoes to wear every day and go into every grocery store, you got a full, you know, the shelves are stacked with any kind of food you want. So seeing kids here, you know, basically eating rice and eggs in the morning, you know, it’s an impact.

John Corcoran 6:06

As an entrepreneur, you know, building a company, there’s lots of ups and downs, I’m sure it puts things in perspective for you, if you have a setback, if you lose a client or something like that definitely helps you to be a little more resilient. Yeah,

Keith Fiscus 6:22

I mean, for sure, you know, I’m a, you learn to become self. Lis. Right. It’s not all about you. And when you’re building a team, when you build an organization, you know, from my perspective, it’s not about you. I mean, we’re here, especially with Ido, right? I mean, I’m here to serve. I’m not Mother Teresa, by no means don’t get me wrong. But, you know, I mean, I think as basic human beings, you know, our objective should be to serve others, be starting a company, you know, you’re there to take care of your employees, make sure their families are taken care of right, and then take care of your clients. So ultimately, I think that’s what you know, experiencing some, you know, resilience, and then some of the things that people go through the hardships, I think, really, hopefully makes us a lot stronger. And that we can give that back and we can be more empathetic. And that’s kind of some of the things I tried to bring to my business, when we started and continue to work.

John Corcoran 7:20

Right. And before you started your business, you had some struggles with substance. Do you want to talk a little bit about what that experience was like? And how that, you know, you often hear about that people in the healthcare professions because you have access to medicines and stuff like that, that that can happen?

Keith Fiscus 7:39

Sure, um, yeah, I was, you know, I mean, at the time, to be honest, when life was a little upside down, I was raising my then five-year-old son, I’d gotten divorced, and I’d won custody of them. So slug going on and hit a lot of low points. And just, you know, I turned to substances really to kind of fill that void, which very quickly got ahold of me, which it always does, with anyone who, you know, unfortunately goes down that path. And just really tough I found myself kind of at a crossroads, I was hit rock bottom, didn’t know what to do, didn’t know where to go.

John Corcoran 8:22

When is rock bottom look like for you?

Keith Fiscus 8:26

Sitting in the shower, crying because I had no control of my life or control. I didn’t feel I had control because something you know, had. I have become weak mentally and physically. And something had basically taken over and I was allowing it to run my life. So So yeah, I mean, at that point, it’s like, you know, um, you know, so I checked into rehab, I spent 30 days in rehab got a chance to get really deep and get a lot of clarity and you know, came out clean and sober

John Corcoran 9:05

and and you still had others that believed in you even if you didn’t believe in yourself. You’ve mentioned your your mother, your then fiance. What did that mean for you?

Keith Fiscus 9:16

Everything right? I mean, I think and I’m not unique in this, I think a lot of us, you know, we have our own insecurities. And we doubt ourselves many times. But I was beyond that, like I just I was, you know, a from my perspective, I was, you know, that was a piece of shit. I wasn’t worthy. I didn’t belong here. But having a support of my then fiance now my wife of just constantly just, you know, no, you know, kind of, especially when I started the company, it’s, you know, those those, you know, when you’re dialing for dollars, right? I mean, you look, you know, I was subleasing a little 10 by 10 Office and staring at a blank board. How do you create nothing from something right? Yes. Keep doing it. So people, you know, when they whenever you have doubt, or I have doubt, but I had people around me who supported me and kept reminding me of what we were accomplishing what I had accomplished in the past, what we are currently accomplishing. And, yeah, it just picks you up, you know, just really, it gave me It motivated me to do what I needed to do to support my family and my community.

John Corcoran 10:23

Right, right. I want to ask you about, you know, I come from a military family. My grandfather was in the Army Air Corps now Air Force. My father was in the Air Force also. And I think that my grandfather, he’s kind of the the opposite of an entrepreneur like he loved the stability basically worked at the Pentagon after he left the the Air Force, love that stability and entrepreneurship requires being okay with a load of chaos from time to time. How do you reconcile those two, you know, with coming from I know, a military family, your other parents or grandparents had been in the military? How have you managed to survive and thrive as an entrepreneur? After having been raised in that kind of background?

Keith Fiscus 11:11

Yeah. Yeah. And like you said, you know, my grandfather in World War Two other grandfather, Korea, my dad was Vietnam. I went in my older sister went in a brother one. And so it was kind of ingrained. Like, I didn’t know, I didn’t know, I just knew that I was going in. And it was it wasn’t an option. It was an option. I just didn’t realize other options, but

John Corcoran 11:30

and you didn’t even realize you’re getting paid. You said,

Keith Fiscus 11:33

Yeah, you know, like I said, in, you know, in boot camp, right. I was, you know, everyone lined us up for formation. I asked what we were doing this and this payday, and I was blown away, because I didn’t even realize that I got paid, you know, not a lot but yeah, and there wasn’t a lot but you know, I didn’t meet need much. And you know, as like, wow, they’re paying me to, you know, like, crawl around and shoot weapons and like, but it was like, This is amazing. I get to have fun. So but yeah, you know, I I love the military. It’s huge. I think it’s a it’s a great opportunity for kids, I think they should make it mandatory like they used to in Europe. 1824 months, I think it’s huge. Because, right? Nobody, when you graduate high school, you know how many people really know what they want to do. You spend some time outside of yourself. You know, in Germany, you either had to go into the OODA sphere, the German army, you had to you know, be a volunteer firefighter, I think and then you or you had to work in like a nursing home. But you have to dedicate 15 to 24 months. That’s it by then you kind of get a feel for what you’re you know, but back to your question. I got in a lot of trouble was in the military, because I was really bad at following orders. I didn’t really like being told what to do, ironically. And I was kind of a smartass. So that doesn’t really go well in the military. But, you know, I got busted to rank a few times, and you know, found myself buffin floors for 30 days and all that stuff. Fun. So yeah, that’s a party. Um, but so in all reality, I don’t think stain staying in the military and retiring from the military and government. It takes a unique personality, right? Because there’s a lot it is very stable, for sure. Great opportunity, retirement, all that great stuff. But you have to be able to deal with a lot of the bureaucracy that goes along with any government job, or essentially any corporate job. So for me long, that long term, that wasn’t an option, because I’m sure I would have eventually either been lost so much rank or, you know, I got my rank back. I did well, but I think I’ve always had that. And when I look back, you know, I mean, like a lot of entrepreneurs now you ask him, it’s like, when did you start work? And it’s like, oh, shoot, man. I started my own detail company, I guess when I was 12. You know, gone and out flyers up and down the street washing cars, waxing cars, I probably damaged more cars than I used them on chemicals. I had no idea what’s going to happen. But

John Corcoran 14:14

what once it so once you start your company, actually first before I get to that, I do want to ask that about, you know, ways in which your military background maybe helped you to implement systems with the company, but when you started the company is a brand new industry for you. And your mother actually became an investor in the company and helped you to get it off the ground. Right. So talk a little bit about how that how she helped you.

Keith Fiscus 14:35

Yeah, for sure. Um, Mother’s been a huge impact. I think mothers are, you know, make a huge impact in everyone’s life. Right? She’s single mom, she raised me since I was five worked two, three jobs to support me so I can play Little League so I can play football, all those things. So she’s always been there to you know, you know, one of them, you know, aside from my wife, probably one of my best friends even today but yeah I mean she when I kind of I wrote up a business plan I wanted to do something new, took some time off from when I was nursing took about a month month off did some did some research put a plan together presented to her she liked the plan. She was also in that industry as well. She was the VP of another large staffing firm and loan me to get a personal loan for $50,000 And you know, that was almost 20 years ago so paid her back within about a year and about a year later she decided to she resigned from where she was a VPN for me kind of funny story is I finally you know as entrepreneurs right we’re starting a company we had no vacation you working seven days a week or we’re going multiple hours finally after a year I decided I’m just going to go on a little three day weekend three day cruise with the family just tune out go on the cruise you know go down into nada Calif coming around Catalina and then I get a call and she said, Hey, I just resigned. How about we started another division? So first, I

John Corcoran 16:13

was like, did you resign first and then join your company? Yeah.

Keith Fiscus 16:18

Yeah, it was kind of backwards. Right. And I was just like, I’m trying to relax. I finally got away for a weekend. And now you know, I got this dropped on me. My wife thought I was going to get off in Catalina and take take the take the ferry back. But you know, so but no huge we started a division together. You know, I was running the science division because that was my background. She started running the kind of a what most people think staffing you know, administrative customer service, a payroll. So she started doing all that division, we built that up. Together. phenomenal job.

John Corcoran 16:57

Let me ask you, let me let me ask you this. So this this has recipe for disaster written all over it. So son starts business in industry, he’s never been in before, but the mom has a deep amount of experience in within a year somehow succeeds in spite of himself. And then Mom quits job, unbeknownst to son, and then joins company. I mean, you’re seeing how like this could be a total disaster, like she could have an idea of this is the way it should go. And you have these ideas of this is the way it should go. How did that work?

Keith Fiscus 17:29

I mean, now that you kind of paint that picture, I guess you’re right. You know, it was yeah, it was a little a little debauchery there early on. But you know, it was incredible. We have a great working relationship. You know, she was mom, she was Arleen. You know, Monday through Friday, from eight to 5505. She was mom, we maintain that professionalism with our staff through the company. I think probably in the 15 years that we are 10-12 years we work together, we might have had two arguments, we call our personalities complemented each other as business professionals. And no, it was it was great, you know, and, again, having her who’s had it had a ton of experience in the industry, I had someone a mentor that I could bounce things off of, you know, help develop my skills. So what could have been really bad really turned out? Pretty great, you know, that? Well, we are able to send her off to retirement with a nice, a nice package, and she enjoys every day walks on the beach and enjoy life. So

John Corcoran 18:37

that’s great. What and so you’re you’re based in Orange County? Did you find particular industries that you went after? Or how did you figure out your niche because because, you know, staffing and career placement can be very broad. There’s a lot of different companies that can get into that industry. So how did you find, you know, a thread or niche to go after that allowed you to thrive?

Keith Fiscus 19:03

Sure. Um, like I said, when I when I first started the company, at that time, in the late 90s, early 2000s, that’s when kind of quote unquote, scientific staffing was really just, it was a new thing it was starting to take off. So, um, science was my background, my passion, so and I had worked when I left nursing, actually, so I, I had gotten a job with another firm, and I worked there for about 15 months. That’s how I kind of cut my teeth. And it was after the 15 months, where I’m like, Man, I can do this better, stronger, faster, you know, and, and then I wrote the business plan and presented it so I got a little taste of it, but I’m like, Yeah, you know, I can do this. Yeah, and I think a lot of that comes from you know, just early on and you know, I mean, again, when the when the army when I was 18. It shaped me and it just, it just helped me develop strong drive. So kind of that’s where we started, I started strictly science placing chemists microbiologists, where I didn’t go after companies per se, but more skill sets, you know what companies utilize these skill sets. And then again, we expanded and went into others other skill sets, you know, the admin and all that good stuff. Yeah, we don’t do light wear light industrial, we don’t do warehouse work. All pretty keep it professional. Yeah. But I tell even I, you know, I tell you, my clients, I’m not we don’t we’re not company specific. We’re skillset specific. So once we get into a company, whether it be with a, you know, with a payroll specialist or a county manager, then we can infiltrate other departments because we have the talent within the organization that can then help other departments in their recruiting efforts. And that’s kind of how we’ve, we’ve grown the business.

John Corcoran 20:51

Makes sense. All right, I want to ask you about this story that Scott Empringham made when I did he told when I had him on the podcast. So, you know, he had a crazy story, you know, kind of his business bottomed out, flamed out spectacularly from 11 million a year down to nothing in a short period of time. And he just hit really rock bottom. And the story that he told me was just so funny, was that I hit rock bottom and didn’t know what to do. I turned to Keith, and I was telling him all these different things that has gone wrong with me. And Keith was like, Haha, that’s great. And you just become a president of the board. And you’re like, can you join my board? And it’s funny the way he tells him because it was kind of like, you know, it’s kind of like you, you, you were drafting him in. But he also says that, you know, you had a bigger plan at play. And maybe you realize that by having him devote himself to some a cause that was larger than himself, and that was focused on others that would perhaps help him to turn things around. So I’d love to hear it from your perspective.

Keith Fiscus 21:54

Or for sure. And you know, first and foremost Scott’s awesome, great guy, great dad. Excellent social media marketing, the everything he does, so I need a I needed a marketing, my mark, mark Holmes guy, and he was just, like, right away, no brainer, hey, you know, he’s my guy. And then it was like, simultaneous, like, you know, I’m putting my board together and all sudden, you know, now Scott’s you know, life is just really, you know, kind of crumbling a little bit, unbeknownst to me. But then it was time we haven’t yet gone to Macau, right. We’re going to Macau for GLC. And then, you know, then we start talking. Start sharing with me, you know how bad things are and financial and so, but I knew, I see so talented. You know, I’m like, Hey, man, I knew that if I can get him there. If I can give him I don’t want to say a purpose. Because he had a purpose, right? He’s a dad, he’s got things to do. And again, I’m not Mother Teresa. But I knew if I could get him engaged in the board that would take him out of some of his own headspace. And give him an opportunity to work with, you know, 12 other amazing, incredible people that would help his skill set, but also being on the you know, going to GLC and being a mark comms guy. Now he’s working with other Mark comms people throughout globally or regionally, which would help or potentially help his business because now he’s, he’s, you know, he’s now networking with all these folks. So yeah, I mean, I’ve made arrangements. I’d like to don’t tell anyone about this. But you know, here’s, I’ll give you a stipend. I’ll give you money ahead of time to help pay for this. And we’ll give you money here. And then we’ll take you know, we’ll do so

John Corcoran 23:44

to help them make it possible for him. Yeah. Yeah. Because otherwise, he would have been on the hook for it. Yeah. Because I just

Keith Fiscus 23:50

knew it was important. I just knew it was important that I thought that it would probably, you know, no matter how painful to his, to his credit, he jumped on board for the ride, pretty much, you know, blindfolded and just like, Alright, let’s do this. Right. So, you know, I don’t think there’s anything that I really did as for what’s what Scott did, and put it putting his fear aside, I just tried to open a few doors for him and kind of nudge him a little bit and kind of, you know, what, yeah, what wouldn’t let him

John Corcoran 24:27

just to kind of reflect back on this, it seems like that’s kind of that’s your roots. That’s where you came from. You come from a family that serves in the military and that’s, that’s what you do. You you help for the greater good, and when you do that, it’ll help you. Is that a fair assessment?

Keith Fiscus 24:44

Um, yeah, you know, I think so. You know, like I said, I mean, I, you know, I was a medic in the military, right? I was, I was a nurse, right? So you’re always you know, I tell people, you know, if you’re in nursing, you’re somewhat codependent. And nothing negative way. But you want to fix things you want to help people you want to, you know, so and that’s where even in my business people are like, how do you go from recruiting to staffing, and for me, it’s like, it’s kind of the same thing at the end, but it’s just a different product. At the end of the day, we’re helping people, whether they’re a new grad, or they’re, you know, an experienced executive, C, C suite, whatever, we’re helping them get into another career or getting into their first career, you know, launching, you know, just helping them get their foot in the door, if I if we can play just a small part in, in changing a little bit someone’s perspective, or life or Outlook or salary. For Golden, and, you know, we’ve, our mission is complete. So yeah, you know, I just, I’m a big baby, you know, I’m like, six to 240, but I’m the biggest baby in the world. And, you know, I just, if I can help,

John Corcoran 26:00

but I loved I loved hearing your perspective on it, because it was really touching. And Scott told the story. So thanks for sharing it, Keith. This has been great. We’ll wrap things up. But the question I always ask, which is, I’m big fan of gratitude. So if you look around at your peers and contemporaries, others in your industry, however you want to define that, you know, who do you respect? Who do you admire that’s doing good work these days? Sure.

Keith Fiscus 26:24

Again, I already mentioned my mother, but I admired her as a, as a strong, single mother, Woman, entrepreneur herself, you know, just killed it. So she’s always someone that I that I look up to, not just because she’s my mom, but because she’s successful. You know, it’s, it’s a successful one. Warren Rustand, and we all know, Warren’s incredible.

John Corcoran 26:50

Great guest on the show as well.

Keith Fiscus 26:52

And you know, another gentleman, his name is John Krueger. We’re about the same age he had an incredible upbringing and with respect to he had a ton of diversity in his life ended up taking over his father’s fabricating company when I think he was 19. Because his father was killed in a plane crash. Unfortunately, John has been amazing. He’s inspiring to me. He’s gone on, you know, to be very successful, but for success, you know, success in John’s eyes as his warns eyes I think its success as defined by family and, and giving back. So that for me is a motivator, right? It’s not all about money. I mean, it makes the world go round. But at the end of the day, you know, it’s like, what’s important, life is too short, right? I just lost a good friend of mine. 58 years old, died at COVID, about three weeks ago, healthy, worked out six days a week. So it’s, and that’s one thing when I worked as a nurse in the emergency room, and forgive me, I ramble. But, you know, every day was different. And you know, you’re, you know, sometimes unfortunately, people don’t make it and you’re tagging them and bagging them. And you’re like, wow, this guy was eating breakfast this morning. It’s now one o’clock in the afternoon, and I’m putting them into a bag. So I think everyone needs to be a little bit. You know, get off the social media a little bit. You know, start connecting more with folks, like in the good old days, have conversations and just be a little bit more empathetic because you just never know.

John Corcoran 28:17

Yeah, that’s a great perspective. Keith, thanks so much for your time. Where can people go to learn more about you and the work that you do?

Keith Fiscus 28:25

Yeah. And again, John, awesome. So thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. But yeah, if we can help you go to our website, That’s Innovative Career Resources and Staffing. So yes, or you can give us a call, you know, 714-508-8620. Anything we can do to help I’m happy to. 

John Corcoran 28:49

Excellent, Keith. Thanks so much. 

Keith Fiscus 28:53

All right, John. Take care, buddy.

Outro 28:56

Thank you for listening to the Smart Business Revolution Podcast with John Corcoran. Find out more at And while you’re there, sign up for our email list and join the revolution. And be listening for the next episode of the Smart Business Revolution Podcast.